Remnants of the Earth
CORRESPONDENCE => Gospel Subnetwork => Topic started by: Anonymous on March 17, 2009, 09:32:33 pm
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- Indigo
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- Indigo
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- Indigo
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use satori for injection
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- Indigo
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- Indigo
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no have satori give the injection
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GA are you retarded?
edit: OIC. could be viable. but encode, doofus.
- Indigo
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fjUIuejgASud32jJf9o raasdif=
there i encoded
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wth
- Indigo
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Right well I said my piece so ya'll have fun eh kiddies? gtg ta-ta.
- Indigo
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Encode this Indigo :heart:
You are like, totally slow! :D
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cant hear you, already gone lalalalala
- Indigo
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Good point about the lockdown and 6 seconds -- also, feel free to talk outside of encryption if it's safe to do so. It can make our lives easier without giving the Seekers too much information. Key RG8 for the following post:
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No, Sylph...sorry.
As for everyone else, I think that it's more important that we work together. Doesn't matter where the ideas originate or what-not. If we're not a team, we will lose, plain and simple. Keep your heads on, wheels turning, think up something fool-proof.
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key = SGl
My two cents.
-Slider out
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[Begin ciphertext, Openkey-Rapid64 encrypted]
k so liek....
Looks like we're all over the place. We haven't decided anything yet. This is how I see it.
1. Any hired hitmen wouldn't be going into the CITADEL ARE YOU NUCKING FUTS? what I was SAYING was, like, us Pilots? We aren't hermits unless you're, like, Remi. Lots of us go down to the middle level, even the lower level. Shed the ole Pilot persona for a while and go back to your roots. That's when our target could get got if ya knowhaddaimean.
2. I take everything I said previously about the hitman idea back because it's stupid and bad and I was bad. It's really flawed. I don't like it and I deserve to be smacked. because yea if we're going to hit any Pilots with that stuff we better make sure we're hitting a lot of them all at once or like the C-man (or girl lol) said it's right back to lockdown and then that's done and over with and it can be cured in 6 seconds if they get ahold of the cure so before we do anything we better make it count or that idea is shot and we might be too lol.
3. We better be FUSKING CAREFUL if we do the hitman thing cause if we get one of our own peeps, and how the hell we gonna know who's who?, then we're screeeeewed and nailed. one of us gets hit, our psionics go bye bye, and we're totes open to any psychic in the place and then it's a crazy fun interrogation and shchick, BLAMMO we're deado. and better hope none of us know a thing about any of the other members or they'll get them too
3. Infirmary idea of mine was also stupid. :oops: let's just forget that one even happened
4. right so whatever happens we should make sure we can get a significant number of em at once. and then what? what do we do after that? There's still the dragons and I'm not even gonna try and fool myself into believing a dose of this concoction would work on even ONE of those. probly not even the whole shipment. well shit guys.
5. so I don't think were gonna be taking out anyone with this stuff BUUUUUUT!
6. have ya'll considered using it not on Pilots but on suspected psychics? no relleh if we keep recruitment down they're going to start feeling it eventually. give to the citizens. power to the people says I! Keep new people OUT. they'll get scared when they can't find any fresh blood.
7. there's more to fighting than just taking out people. Battles can be fought in a lot of different ways. (:
8. start small, work up. we can't do everything overnight, we just dont have the means yet and I think the people are our biggest weapon right now anyway
9. I've been soul searching lately can you tell lol.
[End ciphertext]
- Indigo
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[[doublepost, ignore]]
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[Begin ciphertext, Openkey-Rapid64 encrypted]
You know, I thought of getting it out into the population, but do the math, guys. Population of Haviah... like, what, 20 mill? Okay then! Percentage of population that might be, like, psychic? Let's say less than 1 percent for sure! Hell, let's just say .1 percent! Let's say .01%! How many people is that? That's 2,000 people and probably more! How much of this stuff do we, like, have? 10,000 doses. That last a month each. Like, whoops. At very best thatd last five months. Not exactly drying up the recruiting pool.
Those numbers not good enough for you? OK, let's, like, try another: 50. That's the number of new Candidates in the slowest year of the last twenty, so that's, like, if we totally only got the cure to exactly the ones the Pilots would find. Figure 50 Candidates per year over ten years, that's still, like, guess what, 500. (50 Candidates per year fits with the 2,000 estimate too, cause that'd be about 35 years worth of psychics--a generationish). 10,000 doses at one month per dose, that's just about two years without recruits at very best. And that's only if we can get to them all. I don't know about you guys, but I have a couple contacts in the lower city at best.
So, like, whoopdeedoo! This also means we can't predict which ones the pilots will recruit cause 50 is only what percent of 2,000? 2.5! Awesome!
If that frickin scientist hadn't got caught we wouldn't be this screwed and we could just send the shiz around on the DL while he made more, but, like, no. LOL!
My irony muscles are tired now.
Seriously, guys, we have a problem. Do we know the status of the scientist at all? Because we could really use some more of the stuff if he's not dead or whatever. I don't think the Pilots have him but I'm not sure. And yknow. TRIM.
Unless someone else knows how to make more... because I really, really like the idea of stopping up the source of psychics. Maybe we can get them all together and PUT them somewhere, like try to get them down to Teinar. Somehow. The problem is, I think some nutsos actually want to be Pilots. That's sort of the main problem right there generally.
Now, if we're gonna hit a lot of higherups at the same time, we could just kill them. But do we have a plan that will work? No. And I'm no Prophet (ha ha) but I'm gonna say we won't get one, either, because Indigo is 100% right--it isn't the Pilots who're the problem, it's the Dragons. Get to those and it's game over. I wish we knew if this cure stuff could do anything to a Dragon, cause if we shut those down, we'd be set -.^. Who wants to test that out on the Dragon Imperial?
I'm serious. Anyone want to take teh long ride out with no return ticket?
[End ciphertext]
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Um...I don't know anything about the doctor, but maybe we could find out. I will see what I can find out.
But, um, I am not sure if this is a good idea or not, but all this talk of candidates and the drug....why not slip it to the candidates we have now? None of them are one of us, so no danger there. And...maybe if we are able to hit them all, or randomly, they can't pinpoint who we are....or something. I don't know...it was just a though...
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What'll using it on the current candidates accomplish? =/
umm.....well...OK. So
1. Releasing it to the population is no go because we don't have enough
2. Attacking Pilots is no go because lol we don't have enough and the dragons will eat us. -.-
3. Giving it to candidates is no go because there'll just be a panic and lockdown and investigation and all which we prolly don't want since that's *already* goin down
ARGH. It just sucks we have this great thing but just not ENOUGH. so what CAN we do? I say we hold onto that stuff....i mean I like the idea of gettung a bunch of psychics that hadn't been drafted together andgetting them out of here. of all our options that seems the most feasible right now.
Mebbe we should just hold onto that vaccine whatchamacallit for now...and....um...i dk anyone got any TRIM contacts? We need that scientist guy, or a scientist that can break down the formula and figure out hiow it was made so we can make more. They can *do* that right?
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- Indigo
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Using it on the Candidates will accomplish absolutely nothing. We freeze up the Candidacy for a few months, and then what? Get a few sent to TRIM, while we get handed to the dragons due to what had to have been an inside job.
Hit men are unreliable, and come with far too many strings attached. In order to have one that would be remotely effective, we'd need a tier system... a series of descending rankings that eventually lead down to the man/woman that actually speaks to the hit man themselves. We'd need to have a system that would assure that each step of the ladder doesn't know the man above him (read: impossible) in order to assure that such a thing can't backfire if a Seeker were to catch the hit man in the end and interrogate him.
Dead end. Game over.
Attacking the Pilots is suicidal. The chances of hitting one of our own are too high, and I for one have no intention of handing my identity over to any of you. As stated before, if one of us gets hit, that particular 'cell' (going back to that first friendly analogy presented) of Gospels will be easily terminated.
No doubt that any Pilot that would get hit by this 'cure' would immediately be sent to Axis point to figure out how they got infected... and in the case of Gospels, we'd go straight to the proverbial chopping block.
Dead end.
And since I highly doubt that anyone is close enough to the Imperial to deliver the cure to where it would do the most damage, that seems to be a dead end, as well. Unless someone doesn't mind giving up their life for the cause, of course.
Another point to bring up are the Seekers.
The chances of hitting all of them at once are virtually nil, unless we plan this out... very, very carefully.
Attacking only one would quickly allow them to narrow down potential Gospel suspects, allowing the Seeker to simply have his/her memories searched in order to detain any and all contact they had prior to the infection. If we were to hit one, we would have to hit them all in rapid succession in order to nip this particular problem in the bud. Even then, it's only a temporary diversion- there's no doubt that a direct attack on the Seekers will only encourage them to recruit more. Not to mention that they will not allow themselves to be inoculated with it again.
Whenever we move, we need to look with what we can do with one month. The chances of infecting them with this cure more than once is extremely minimal. Though we can throw a snake into a nest and it may bite a few people, it's soon smashed as soon as the panic wears off and the occupants regain their rational minds again.
I would hold onto the cure until the time is right, and plan an immediate follow-up. It's too soon for such a thing, right now. Let's not be hasty. We can't afford to make a mistake now, and reveal our hand too soon.
Let us hold onto our trump card, and keep it under wraps until they are convinced that it was nothing but a hoax. Only then should we consider using it- and even then, only with a very careful set of plans to assure that the mission has a minimal chance of failure.
Indigo: Unfortunately, I've no contacts in TRIM.
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Do we need to save the scientist? It will keep us from feeling like the cold, heartless bastards we are, and it may aid us later in terms of the widespread distribution of the nanobots. We should think about it, but it's not absolutely necessary.
At the moment he can only synthesize a substance which, while fast-acting, only remains in effect for one month. It is not permanent, but it could be an invaluable weapon in a revolt of some kind. Keep in mind that 10,000 vials would certainly be enough to use on every Pilot in the Citadel. There aren't that many of us. If we could arrange a large-scale delivery, it would have the added effect of temporarily closing the psychic link between each Pilot and his or her dragon - meaning no more monitoring of your location if you're a Gospel, and no calling on your dragon for backup if you're a Seeker. Unfortunately for us, such widespread distribution is unrealistic at best, and everyone but Fala would have to deal with his or her wireless port somehow. In other words, there would still be cute, heart-bordered Axis invitations.
Considering this problem, Vallewida's concept of targeting Seekers in particular may be our best course of action. That's a lot easier. We may have to wait until they're sent to a simultaneous Axis probing, but it happens on a reasonably frequent basis. Once they do, we're golden. Pilots have proven a tendency to take any drug placed in front of them during an interrogation, and I don't see how anyone can tell the difference between a truth serum, a muscle relaxant, and a vial of nanobots. Even the delivery can be a blind - swap out the standard interrogation aids with our drug in the lab and when the Seekers go to pick it up they will actively use it on one another. No identities compromised, and we get them all at once - they won't even notice their lack of psychic ability until the lead room doors are unlocked, and by then they'll all have taken the stuff.
It's one method for targeting the Seekers, but alone it's useless. Remember that if they are out of commission for any significant amount of time, we may only have a week or so of disorganization and chaos before the Dragons or the Imperial appoint new, acting ones with psychic ability... and they'll look very carefully at the possible choices. There will be Axis. That means if we're hoping to get away with something that matters, we need to put it into action immediately after the nanobot caper. Vallewida's completely right in saying we should hold back on it until we finalize the timetable for a second phase.
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Saving the scientist I think would be difficult. He's been caught because of our mole, but does anyone know if they removed him from TRIM? Do we know if he was brought to the citadel at all? It makes sense that he would have been interrogated...prob ably a HUGE interrogation, after all, he did market his products to us. Heh. I don't know anything about his whereabouts, but it'd be awesome if we could find that out. Maybe he was interrogated and let go (unlikely) but considering all possibilities... Maybe he's been assimilated into some reformation program or whatnot...and even if he was released, after this will this guy want to risk it all again to make more for us?
That aside...if we could somehow help him, I think that would seal the deal. He'd be indebted to us, right? I mean...it'd make sense, I scratch your back, you scratch mine. And saving him would definitely help with the bastard-feeling-ness...it'd be nice to save instead of destroy...maybe *shrug*
As for using it on the candidates...I really don't see that being much help at all. Once they can't perform it's straight to TRIM and that's blood on my hands I don't think I can handle. They're not pilots yet, and yes many of them one day will be...but at the same time most people don't want to be pilots in the first place. We'd be depleting not only potential pilots, but potential gospels as well. Not that it's terribly important, we have a large number as is, but getting more would certainly help.
Dunno...maybe that's a stupid way of thinking.
Using it on the seekers? Sounds like a good plan in my book, they would never see it coming. But Sylph is right, it would cause a week or two of chaos and intensive screenings on everyone. We would need to have some sort of follow-up plan after the distribution. Once they're cut off, more than likely the seekers themselves will go a little bonkers without the Network stimulating their brains, maybe some of them'll even off themselves (one can only hope), but that's not enough....in the time of chaos that the seeker's are indisposed, what can we do to handicap the system even more? We'd weaken the collective I guess...but it's still only downing 5 pilots....there are many more where they came from.
Sorry, that was a whole bunch of ramble. I'm just thinking out loud.
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Slider--the scientist hasn't been sent to the Citadel. Silly Seeker with the blog let it out that TRIM won't release him, or at least I think that's what he was talking about.
OK, so we don't need to save the scientist, Sylph, but I'm troubled by your attitude. That said, let's just talk about the practical here--the information he has could be very useful to us. I say we push for his transport from TRIM to Haviah. It's a legit thing to ask if we're Pilots, the Seekers will pat us on the head, and if he's here we may get access somehow. Sure, it's risky for him, but as Sylph says, we're cold-hearted bastards who don't care if the people who help us live or die.
Aren't we?
Tell that to my friends waiting it out in the lower city, tell that to the Teinari who might be willing to harbor undetected psychics for us (and we don't need the 'cure' for that, but that's another story, folks, ask me later). Tell that to anyone who reads your Report, Sylph, which, by the way, is there any way we can use that to get more info out of the Seeker, instead of whatever you're doing, trying to start a flame war, I don't know?
Next item: I agree we should target the Seekers--excellent idea. I suggest that anyone able should try to implant memories of Gospel activity while the Seekers are psychically incapacitated. Anyone here capable of that? Just imagine the runaround that would give them--one or all of the Seekers, an accused Gospel. I bet they wouldn't even wait a month to prove innocence or guilt.
So it causes chaos--there'll be chaos. I believe chaos is what Sylph has been aiming for. Popular uprising. Etc.
It is no secret that I disagree with your methods, Sylph, but going public has one thing in its favor--it's fricking public. Like I've said, I know a few undiscovered psychics and they know a few more people who could start raising hell in the lower city while this went down. We could even get the scientist out during the commotion, and that, friends, may be part of the point. It'll all take planning, but isn't this--isn't it, Sylph--kind of the point?
Chaos, that is.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
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Yah, I was under the impression, when I joined the Gospels, that we're the ones *not* the bad guys, guys. You know, whole point of the Gospels as *I* understood it was standing up for the little guy and liberating people and fucking up the system in *order* to liberate the little guy. Otherwise what are we? What's the point? We're no different from them and *that's* not what I joined for and that's not what I'm risking my life for. People aren't supposed to be just pawns we can use and discard. That's what the fucking system does with US. That's what we're protesting! Gods but these people, our contacts, they trust us and they're helping us and risking their lives to help us and our cause.
I'd prefer there to be as few casualties as possible..... though I'm not going to kid myself into thinking we're not gonna have to kill some folks too since peaceful resistance ain't happenin here, or that some people will be killed helping us, and yea we can't save everyone that gets caught, including ourselves.
but uh like *candidates*? Dunno about you guys but I'd be working on bringing them to our side. Decrease their numbers, increase ours.
As for the scientist guy....yea, we need him. And yea it'd be nice to rescue him, but we also gotta be careful not to get caught too.
idk, but I was kind of thinking after I read Chimmy's post....
How are we gonna get to the scientist once he's in Haviah? He'll be under tight security in the Citadel.
We may not be able to get near him.
So dunno how well this'd work but like....anyone know any pirates?
DON'T LAUGH LISTEN! It's a stretch but it's an idea and i'm just sort of throwing stuff out there so yea
1. so we push to get this guy headed toward Haviah.
2. They agree.
3. We find out the info about the vessel transporting him so we can track it
4. Contact some pirates. uh obvs someone reliable that's not gonna screw us over. as far as pirates go. Preferabbly peeps that trade with Teinar - someone from the Cancer, say. can't just be anyone, gotta be reliable and have one hardcore vessel - or multiple pirates, hey that works
5. ATTACK AEDOLIAN VESSEL! cmon I doubt they'll send Pilots for somethin like that, he'll be guarded by grunts probly. idk we'd have to do research and find out the specs beforehand
6. capture scientist man!
7. Take him to Teinar, hide him there.
8. HUZZAH! he's saved, he gets to make more of that stuff, trade through the underground gets it here and everyone wins
9. ?????
10. PROFIT
the last two don't count I just wanted an even ten.
.......yea I know it sounds hokey but hey it could work.
[End ciphertext]
- Indigo
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We don't need the scientist. We just need his information. Let's be clear: we need the info. We want to save the scientist. Because we are the good guys.
And we really, really need the rest of the Pilots not to get it. Think about this one, folks: what happens if they decide to use the psychic cure on us, one by one? What a good Gospel-finding method--no shields. So, Sylph, there's your pragmatic reason to get the scientist into our own hands, ASAP. If we don't, we could be screwed.
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We don't need the scientist. We just need his information. Let's be clear: we need the info. We want to save the scientist. Because we are the good guys.
And we really, really need the rest of the Pilots not to get it. Think about this one, folks: what happens if they decide to use the psychic cure on us, one by one? What a good Gospel-finding method--no shields. So, Sylph, there's your pragmatic reason to get the scientist into our own hands, ASAP. If we don't, we could be screwed.
I believe you misunderstand my attitude about saving the scientist. There are a number of practical and moral reasons why we should pursue that road as soon as we can, and that's why I brought it up. Apart from the obvious benefits to our organization, we owe it to him. On the other hand, if he were already in a cell guarded by Seekers at all times, we wouldn't be smart to throw caution to the wind (Chimera has determined that he's still at TRIM, so the point is moot). Cold heartless bastards was just a reminder that we are indeed still Pilots, no matter how much we may profess a doctrine of liberty - dunno, maybe the irony was lost on you.
Indigo seems to have the right idea, but at the moment I do not have any active contacts among TRIM's internal security, nor am I at liberty to pull rank and make threats. Does anyone have influence with the Imperial? He might be able to do it. I know pirates, anyway; that won't be difficult.
The most recent blog post was filler, nothing more. I have to acknowledge that I've seen Alesku's work. He'll have questions for me and maybe he'll let something slip re: military strategy. Flamewar implies pointlessness, but I think I may be able to draw something meaningful out of the dialogue it will no doubt spark.
It'll all take planning, but isn't this--isn't it, Sylph--kind of the point? Chaos, that is. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Chaos alone isn't worth a dragon toenail clipping. That said, it's a great way to help facilitate other goals.
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Other goals--for instance? I ask sincerely, Sylph, because I think quite a few of us are curious.
I'll lay my hand on the table: my goal is the protection of undiscovered psychics and their eventual transfer to Teinar, where we can perhaps establish some sort of base of operations outside of Haviah. Outside of the Citadel, for that matter.
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I speak of any unified aims of the Gospels - what does everyone want out of this? Doubtless the anonymity and inevitable confusion instilled in the ranks of the Seekers will aid us in any endeavor, so if someone has an idea they are welcome to share it.
The Sylph Report is simply a reflection of my own long-term hopes for Aedolis - while I'd like to see many of the concepts and social structures mentioned there come to fruition, it's an ongoing process and it certainly won't happen within the few weeks we have.
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Chimera....you say that we don't need the scientist, and maybe in the long run that's true, but do you really think without the TRIM facilities where he has access we can duplicate any information we gather from him? I don't know about you, but I was trained in combat and in psychic abilities, not scientific nanobots. Even WITH the information, without him will we be able to duplicate his results without killing someone?
Not to mention, I think it's pretty shitty to be like, "Oh hey, could you give us your research? Awesome, man. Oh, btw, you're screwed. See ya." He wants to help us, why else would he contact us about his findings? I think we should do something for him, try to protect him in some way, even if it proves futile. Indie's right though, I thought the whole point of us is to help people. I understand that's not always possible, but when someone puts their neck on the line I think we should at least try to do something.
Maybe I misunderstood you, Chimera, but I really want to try to do something. That's my vote.
I also think that it's great, in theory, to want to help the undiscovered psychics...but as stated before, unless we can give it to everyone, what are the chances we'll catch the psychic's before they're screened and taken? And, like I said before, using it on the candidate's is...to put it bluntly, stupid. I'm glad that Indie feels the same way as I do.
Instead, what if we double our efforts to instill fear in normal people about the pilots? The more fear is there, the more likely anyone recruited will want to join the gospels. Maybe even make some sort of hack...something... .fabricate something that the seeker's did to make the general masses even MORE afraid, or maybe just plain angry?
Just an idea...but what would happen if, when the seeker's are down, we were able to shut down the spas, movies, everything that Aedolis uses to keep people happy. There would be an uproar. The general way of life that most are use to would be compromised. The people would then, hopefully, stop being afraid of the government and instead the government would be afraid of them. The more we can instigate displeasure in the normal citizens, the more they'll want to fight back against the system as well.
Is there anyway we could do a city-wide hack?
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Okay, guys, I'm sorry I started any strife, this is not supposed to be about oneupmanship. I'll be straight about my issues in this post.
You did misunderstand me, Slider. My point was simply that, while we don't absolutely need the scientist, we should save him. I apologize again for starting any mudslinging over the compassion and morality issue. I think we're all agreed: save the scientist. I think the pirate idea is a good one. In fact, if we're gonna use the 'cure' we'd better save him before we prove its existence and therefore his guilt.
So I say for now we focus on saving the scientist, priority one. But here's the thing. Do we have to save the scientist if we don't use the cure? Let's say we don't use it. OK, so people don't know the thing exists. They assume it's a hoax or a setup. I've been reading up on the scientist, what I can find on public channels. This guy has messed up his brain. I'm not sure it's readable. I'm not sure he won't come out of this innocent. Think about it, if he were clearly guilty wouldn't the Seekers have more claim on getting him transported? ANyway, if he is proven innocent he can just stay and make more of the stuff, /and/ pass on the info he didn't to begin with, just in case. OK, long shot. But possible. And another reason we should wait.
I do not, Slider, think we need to 'instill fear.' I think we should totes rally the people somehow, but in a more underground way so it can actually succeed. The Pilots do a pretty good job of instilling fear on their own anyway.
I also think you misunderstand my big-picture plan.
1. I have friends in the lower city, undiscovered psychics and otherwise. They have friends. They can help us.
2. How can they help us? Well, by establishing a base of operations, with psychic capacity, outside of Haviah. Somewhere in the Midhaven, or, if possible, in Teinar, where I have one or two contacts. Granted, they're contacts who are a bit leery of me, but hey. I'm a Pilot after all.
3. Thus far my friends haven't exited the city because we and a lot of people they can help are here. My project, again, is to shore up an underground method of collecting undiscovered psychics, consolidate them, and get them out of range of Pilot jurisdiction. In short, underground (or similar). Train them. Organize them. Etc. I think that's important. Plus, some of them can keep doing work for us in the city. Like I said, I don't know that many people (safety first, can't get out toooo much, don't want people knowing who I am), but they know people, and, well, right.
4. How does all this involve the chaos that will go down if we stick the Seekers with the cure? Well, okay. We stick the Seekers. We have organized some people in the Lower City to start rioting and making everyone paranoid that what Sylph prophesied in his/her blog may be coming true. Pilots --> lower city. Gospels --> ???. ???? because we are not powerful enough to do SHIT yet. It's a plan for the FUTURE, guys. Not even the near future. Frankly, I don't think we should rush to use the 'cure' at all. I think we should wait, because we just don't have the firepower to use it appropriately. As far as I know. I'm not suicidal, or I would try the Dragon Imperial business, because we need to use the stuff for something big.
ANYway, while I'm being straight (and I'm fricking scared about talking this candidly even over secure channel--if I've been unclear thus far that's why--I hope we don't have another godsdamn mole)--Sylph. Sylph, I'm worried. Your plan, on the Report? Popular uprising from what I can make out of it. The blog itself supports that, since it's a popular rallying-point. Okay, fair enough. In fact, neato, I like involving the people. But your last post had better just be a diversion for the Seekers. This thing is just not going to start and succeed on the streets, not without a lot of unnecessary bloodshed.
I just don't see why we shouldn't first work to weaken Aedolis by siphoning out and actively recruiting psychics for a resistance, and then try to run a strike (from inside and outside) on the place where it really matters, in other words, the Citadel. The Dragons. The higherups. I know it's clicheed, but since Indie likes snake metaphors so much--cut off the head....
So that's my position. That, everyone, is what I've been worrying over.
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Sylph, I'm worried. Your plan, on the Report? Popular uprising from what I can make out of it. The blog itself supports that, since it's a popular rallying-point. Okay, fair enough. In fact, neato, I like involving the people. But your last post had better just be a diversion for the Seekers. This thing is just not going to start and succeed on the streets, not without a lot of unnecessary bloodshed.
I just don't see why we shouldn't first work to weaken Aedolis by siphoning out and actively recruiting psychics for a resistance, and then try to run a strike (from inside and outside) on the place where it really matters, in other words, the Citadel. The Dragons. The higherups. I know it's clicheed, but since Indie likes snake metaphors so much--cut off the head....
I'm only pointing out that it's feasible for a certain subgroup to take control of its factories and infrastructure and seal off the elevators. It's a critical security weakness, and the Seekers know it. As soon as we do something overt (i.e. stick the Seekers with the cure), it is far more likely that Pilots will be sent to predictable locations - again, something we want.
We should weaken the Citadel first, as much as we can. I have not put forward an actual call to rebellion, and I refuse to do so until we're sure we know what we're doing and have passed the point of no return. For now, it's a public opinion move; we want enough people to be sufficiently pissed at the Pilots if we do have to invoke popular support in the Lower City. Gospels might end up needing safehouses, contacts, or simply people willing to turn a blind eye to subversive activity. I reason that if we have a strong base of passive dissenters now, half our work is already done.
Instead, what if we double our efforts to instill fear in normal people about the pilots? The more fear is there, the more likely anyone recruited will want to join the gospels. Maybe even make some sort of hack...something... .fabricate something that the seeker's did to make the general masses even MORE afraid, or maybe just plain angry?
Just an idea...but what would happen if, when the seeker's are down, we were able to shut down the spas, movies, everything that Aedolis uses to keep people happy. There would be an uproar. The general way of life that most are use to would be compromised. The people would then, hopefully, stop being afraid of the government and instead the government would be afraid of them. The more we can instigate displeasure in the normal citizens, the more they'll want to fight back against the system as well.
I feel that we have to be honest about this. Think about it -- as soon as the mindless entertainment shuts down, the military will announce that it was a Gospel plot and the public will observe Citadel techs putting everything back online. We'd be handing them an excuse to go out and clean up the streets, and popular opinion would swing against us. I strongly oppose fabricating anything... we have enough material already; all we have to do is point at it and people will understand.
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I have a link- two, actually- one on Cancer (provided they haven't gone somewhere else) and one on Edanith. I've been assured that the first will be free to aid me at anytime, and said Cancer link also enables me to contact someone within the middle class of the Aedolis populace. My Edani contact has a few strings to pull... but not too many. That contact is still (and understandably so) wary of me, and I'm hesitant to ask them any favors.
However, said Edani contact has let me know that they are available if the scientist (or any potential Gospel ally) is to have a chance at hiding out on Mars, if we can get them there.
...Which is close to zero, of course. I've no delusions. But the offer's still there, if anyone needs hiding. My source assures that, on the extremely off chance we could get someone there, they would be willing to hide them extremely well. They should be able to cover them even to the point of assimilating them into the general populace with a new identity, should it come to that.
If we were to have a means to get the scientist out, which I doubt, there's little way to keep him hidden IN Aedolis. We'd have to make sure he didn't get here in the first place, if he's to stand a chance, really. If we're to take the 'sit and wait' approach, that's fine. Just realize that there's a good chance he'll die, no matter what we do.
To take the pirate route is risky, and we also risk exposing Teinar if we take that route- I would recommend taking him to Edanith. From there, I can get into contact with my source and have them relay information as they've done for me in the past. Through this means, we have the ability to gain information concerning the formation of the nanobots... but with the added problem of the scientist lacking the materials to build more himself.
We would have to take over from there. I've no contact with experts in such a field, however.
A total upheaval of the system? We're not ready for such a thing. Not even close. Pulling out the rug of comfort from beneath the feet of the citizens will only make them rally against us. Better to let the Pilots perform needless painful interrogations in the streets to try to find spies, and let the people's grudges fester and grow.
Let the Seekers' paranoia do the work for us. Only when we are ready will we strike.
Or so I would hope.
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yea let's not get TOO ahead of ourselves now guys.
And let's remember somethin: the lower caste is crappy. The middle? Not so shabby. Upper? Oooo man you got it made. Your lower caste peeps are the ones that're gonna be seeing all the shit go down, middle...kind of. Not as obvious, more subtle. Lots of those folks are apathetic. the lower folks want deliverance, but the middle? apathetic. Indifferent as long as it doesn't bother THEM. Censorship? LOL who cares as long as they don't miss their favorite soap!
Some of them care, but come on, pop culture's good at brainwashing. They can turn a blind eye. Corruption isn't as overt up there as it is down below.
and the upper? boy do they love their comforts.
If we screw that up they're gonna hate US. Revolution is about more than just fighting, right? We can't pull any plugs yet and we can't do any extreme stuff yet because we just don't have the resources OR THE ALLIES. We need the support of the people or this is gonna backfire. First we have to convince them that their country is one messed up place responsible for numerous atrocity's and abuses, and then convince them to even give a damn about it. Sure some middle caste average joe might have a friend who's son got sucked into the Pilot program and vanished but it's not HIS son and hey that's just the risk you take for the sake of safety right? Your civic duty!
Fuck that shit. Aedolis is one big propaganda machine, let's crank out our own. Yea we've been distributing banned texts and crap about free-thinking and all but I'm talking classified stuff. It's risky, but anyone thought about leaking some damning, classified junk to the public? About what REALLY goes on behind the scenes in their utopia? Anyone got any access to it? It'd be fun.
course hack someone else's stuff, don't hack your own. That would be dumb.
Back on topic, though, We're thinking too big for right now people. Let's just focus on FIRST getting the scientist yea?
Scientist first. Other stuff later.
Time is ticking.
STAY FOCUSED ON WHAT'S IN FRONT OF YOU
[End ciphertext]
- Indigo
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Like, slow down there fellows! We like, totally need to take a chill pill! Lets, like, get some info first people! OMG for sure! Okay, like, first off, does the scienctist even, like need saving? Because, like, do we even know that, it's, like that dude?
Because, he like, signed his name, but, like so what? Signing my name, like, Dancia doesn't, like, mean I am her (even though I like, totally am ^_~). So, like, how about we like, find that stuff out! Because going in, like, half cocked will just lead to us getting, like, totally messed up. Unless, like, it's Indigo. Yo should, like totally bust into TRIM guns blazing! :heart: :heart: :heart:
But, like, the rest of us, should like, find some stuff out. And like, stop bickering. Because, like, really? I don't, like, want to get caught here! And so, I am not going, to like, help some stupid half-assed plan. Because like, if we rescue this guy, and like, he's totally the wrong dude, then what?
It's not like, seekers haven't been wrong before. I mean, like, they are lead by, like Marshal. I think that, like totally leaves room for error.
I think it might, like, be a better plan if we work on, like, getting the masses to love us. Because that is where the power is. Like, the seekers are powerful. But, totally guys, the power is in the masses. Make them, like, aware that they, like, don't have to live some shitty little life. Because, like, if we keep getting painted as villains and like, are totally not giving them a different idea, like, who is going to like, revolt with us?
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jdnflkfbhjbkqlkljwh YOU JUST TOTES REPEATED EVERYTHING I SAID SERAPHIM WTF I WAS JUST TALKIN ABOUT GETTING THE MASSES TO LIKE US SO DONT PULL THAT AND ACT LIKE IT WAS TOTALLY ALL YOU
and I didn't say attack TRIM! Reading Comprehension 101! RTFM! And we're saving him because were nice people AND we need the vaccine.
GOSH
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- Indigo
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Seraphim, please keep in mind that this is a serious discussion. From a readability standpoint, I ask that you find/replace the word like with a blank space in your posts before you add them to the thread. While accepted linguistic authorities today may consider such speech normal among adolescents, it has never been acceptable on the subnetwork. You're typing the seeds of revolution, so act like it.
Securing the scientist seems pretty vital at this point. If we keep him safe, he can continue his research and we can prevent it from falling into the wrong hands.
Indigo has an excellent point about caution and the media. Taking a propaganda-centric approach will allow us to influence popular opinion (thought outright lies will backfire, since the Pilots can expose our fabrications as easily as we call them out on theirs). What we need is solid, concrete evidence. I particularly encourage everyone to actively observe interrogation techniques, as they may provide valuable insight into the life of a Pilot. There's nothing quite like realizing your nation tortures its own.
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Like, to bad that, like you don't like how I talk. Because, like, I like it. So there. Sorry if, like, I don't meet you, like linguistic standards, but like, I am not getting caught because, like, there is another mole and they try and figure us out based on how we talk. So, like, shove it Sylph :heart:
Also, like, I repeat. How do we, like even know this is the guy? Like, I am all for saving the dude if it is totally the right guy. But, like, what if he isn't? He could, like be framed. So, let's like, find that out before we go in all hot and heavy. Like, that is all I am saying we do.
:heart: ,
Danica Blake
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Even if he is not, Seraphim, the risk that the Pilots might get their hands on the 'psychic cure' is an intolerable one. They could inject us one by one and root us all out. They may be silly, but they're not dumb. The idea suggests itself. There are two absolutely compelling reasons why we should save Macario:
If he is a blind, our saving him will make them think they can stop looking.
If he's not, we win anyway. I was skeptical about the need to save him, when inaction is easier, but if we can... we should. Now... how? If he's going to be transported from TRIM we'll have to keep a close watch.
Oh, and if it's not him, why did his communications cease when the real Macario was captured, eh? We know the cure is real. I am inclined to believe the scientist is real as well. Sylph, are your connections able to watch TRIM for any exiting transports? Can anyone get a handle on when and if they're transporting this guy?
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If Macario's the right scientist, he will most definitely help us. We're pretty sure he is.
If he isn't, we're saving an innocent man who will owe it to us to take a look at the nanobots anyway (or alternatively, work for the Citadel if we don't rescue him). He's a leading authority in the field, from what I understand... so even a complete misjudgment wouldn't be against our interests.
Seraph, not going to demand anything, but liking fewer things would be a simple courtesy. My eyes hurt.
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To Imperial Xhi,
The terms for the transfer of N. Macario and complete laboratory records are fiscal in nature. TRIM has no interest in conflict with Aedolis. However, our research is our livelihood. As such, we request immediate transfer of four million (4,000,000) credits from Aedolis to TRIM before we begin transfer.
signed,
TRIM Directorial Board
Sec. Chief Mali Nehman
Mr. Nehman clearly isn't paid enough. There's nothing more sad than insecurity at the top level.
So there you have it, straight from his sent messages. TRIM clearly has its act together, because there is no reason they should be holding onto this man. From what I understand, his advancements are impractical if not entirely theoretical, and he has a nasty drug habit. They're getting a good deal and Aedolis will doubtless accept.
Vallewida, call up your pirate friend. We aren't sure when this transfer will happen, but we know it's coming.
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OOC: People should be really careful about limits and approval, as always. This is Sam's plot, so go to her if you have any questions.
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Vally, honey,
No.
Not stickin' my nose in TRIM shit. Sorry, hon. Far too risky.
Just not worth losing my life over. If you could confirm that he's a great Gospel ally with limitless potential, then sure, I'd help. But you're asking me to help a guy that TRIM wants to get rid of in a heartbeat. I smell a trap. At the very least, you guys are gonna be packin' some serious heat- well, maybe not you, but the other Pilots. If you guys want him that badly, you get him out yourself. It's suicide.
Get him to Edanith, maybe. I hear you've got someone there.
But I can't help you here. Sorry. :p
...It appears my so-called 'pirate' source has fallen through.
I'm attempting to revive negotiations. My Edani contact has still expressed interest, however...
I can't leave the planet, as you're aware, but once in our territory, Aedolis wouldn't dare enter without at least a full fleet behind it. And for one man, I doubt that would be the case.
Of course, separating him from the rest is your task, not mine.
He is the only viable contact I have left, it seems, that could house him. Provided we could get him out of TRIM hands, of course.
Do we have a rough estimate as to when it could happen?
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Standard Pilot procedure will help us here. We never hand over money in advance, and TRIM won't budge until they at least have a pending transfer order on the table. Aaaand...
To: TRIM Directorial Board
Sec. Chief Mali Nehman
Those terms are acceptable. I will transfer credit when you transfer the scientist to Aedolian hands. I will be in touch when we have finalized security arrangements for the scientist's transfer.
- Imperial Xhi
...guess who got mail today.
So now we know Xhi will be putting out his pending order for the four million as soon as those involved in securing Neel have been informed. Pilots? Seekers? Not sure about this one. In any case, it will be an Aedolian transport and the exchange will be scheduled for the moment it arrives at TRIM. That's all we need. While I cannot personally perform any kind of credit trace right now, I'm sure someone else can.
Chimera, maybe? Anyone who isn't an Echo or under close scrutiny will do. If you have access, take a look through the records and see when the transfer will happen. Thanks in advance.
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I make no promises, but I'll see if I can't look through the records and find any information about the transfer. It's not going to be easy, especially if all the seekers are banned together on this one.
However...something interesting I stumbled across while lying awake at night. Anyone else notice the scientist's name? Macario? Ring any bells? Well it should. Our own beloved seeker Alesku Macario. Whether or not there are any actual relations between the two or not I don't know... but it may not be coincidence that they have the same name. And if they're related, what does that do to security...would it change anything in the transfer? Would this help us in any way?
Once again...not sure if there really is any connection...anyone able to check this? See what's there? We could, possibly, work this to our advantage....maybe get one of the seekers framed if there is some correlation...even one seeker down would help.
Thoughts?
-Slider
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Yes. As a quick VCN search should tell you, they're brothers. Hey, guys--any of you Alesku? I thought there was something fishy about that blog.
As I must've told Sylph at some point--I've got access to some of TRIM's internal security code. Not enough to be all that useful (typical), but enough. I'm not free enough to watch the data 24/7, but I'll set an automated message for the next transfer that fits the data pattern for scientist-->4,000,00 c.
But, um, I think we need a better plan here. So, great, we have someone who can take the scientist on Edanith. How are we going to get him there? Any of us in on the planning of the transfer?
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